Dirt Rider Magazine

markyrocks

Did valve check on my Ltz 400 and one of my intake valves is at 0 clearance. From what I read if was run that far out of spec, that is most likely cupped therefore shot. I've talked to a mechanic friend of mine and he said if I'm gona change one I should change them all. Makes sense. I'm gona replace Cam chain while I'm in there as well. (I'm kinda pissed bout this BC I just spent money fixing my car) an we bought this quad last summer an barely rode it, prolly less than 10 hours. That why I didn't check em before an the jerkoff said they were recently checked. It had to be like this when we bought it. I'm just glad I caught it before the valve sheered off an destroyed the head or worse.

Does anyone have an opinion as to who makes best reliable valves?

masterlink

zero clearance doesnt mean u need a valve job. it just means u need 2 install a smaller shim. wat size shim is in there?

Kiwi450x

Masterlink has an unhealthy obsession with valves...

markyrocks

I understand that in normal circumstances that I would just reshim. BUT I belong to another forum dedicated to my specific quad and the people who are in the know basically say the stock valves are crap, once there at 0 reshim will only be like a one day ride fix. I'm gona get into it a lil further today but I'm willing to bet it was at 0 before an was already reshimmed to account for that. An that the adjustment only was short lived (because the other 3 are in spec .... barely). Mind u this quad 9yrs old so I'm sure valves have been shimmed a few times already. For me to think something is "bad" I don't really think it too far fetched.

masterlink

The thing is if u were close enough 2 check ur valve lash. anuther 10 minutes of loose'n ur cam caps and chain adjuster would have told u the story of shim size and valve condition. Its not rocket science.

The nice part aboot steel valves is u can lap them or just replace the bad 1 and recut the seat. But I kno how u quad guys r. Riding with sneakers and no helmet, and no maintenance and then scouring the forums asking y me? And then brand bashing.

no saying its u directly marky ole boy, but if its 9 yo and u dont kno when the last valve job was, then it was in the hands of 1 of THEM. LOL

masterlink

also how can u say stock valves r crap if u think they lasted 9 years??

markyrocks

Well like I said I ain't had the quad that long. It mainly been sitting since October an really only took it on two trail rides. Trust me dude I didn't put it back together I just checked the clearance an threw some rags over the head and called it a night. Maybe the stock valves aren't "crap" I just said that was others opinions. If I can get a better valve than stock for similar price makes no sense not to. And I definitely have proper riding gear. Yes the previous maintenance was in someone else's hands. Most likely did do shim job on it before, learned of the fact that the valves are a common issue an just listed it forsale, now it my problem.

I can tell this is going nowhere I found a complete set of wiseco valves for like 85$. I'm prolly just gona get them.

masterlink

whos gonna cut the seats or r u gonna replace those also?

masterlink

also, dont 4get 2 check ur guides. no sense in spend'n $85 on valves and more on seat work and then not touching the guides. jus say'n.

masterlink

Nick STFU!!

markyrocks

Can I just get the new valves and lap them? Or is that a no no? Idk I know there couple machine shops around here. I think Napa does it but I got to call around.

masterlink

can u? sure. should u? no. atleast have ur machine shop should look at them. The valve angle will tell the story. if the edge of ur bad valve looks thin cut potato chip then ur seat will be that way as well. lapping compound will address minor imperfections, it wont undu seat damage.

markyrocks

Ya I love how the world works. I found a video showing how a monkey can reshape the seats. Each one takes like 5 min to do. Only kicker is the tool kit that you need to do it cost like 300$.....

masterlink

the world?? we r talking aboot a valve train here. FOCUS!

Kiwi450x

Don't say I didn't warn you Marky... LOL I'd cut and run before he hunts you down.

markyrocks

Looks like it only gona cost 40$ have valve seats recut. Btw I just bought a set of wiseco forged steel one piece valves. New gaskets and seals. Ill inspect guides tonight.

Maple Leaf MX

Holla

markyrocks

When I change them should I take pics and do like a "how to " thread?

CRWOODS

that would be swell

markyrocks

Id just like to update this while its fresh in my mind. I was working on this quad late night, I been fighting the flu or sumthin past two days so I slept about 24 hrs straight. Long story short as I'm ripping this bike down I'm ripping the previous owner apart. Because of how half assed they did putting it together.

Anyway so I found where the Carb connects to the airbox wasn't even connected it was just hanging there, sucking in whatever air was hanging around ...... really pissed me off.

Here's a pic of the intake valve, as you can see on the top portion there's a good coating of dust and carbon meaning dirty air and a lack of a seal.....

Heres a pic of the exhaust valves side by side, the one don't look half bad , the other one looks like its growing a Christmas tree of carbon build up.....

Only good news is that after I do this valve job this quad prolly gona seem like the power has doubled. I never thought it felt that powerful for a 400..... now I know why. I should of done before an after compression checks, but it had to of been less than 100, most likely less.

An Sean don't get all pumped up this quad prolly has over 1000 hrs on it.

sean

1000 hrs,, good quad that's what im talking about,,I had the flu few weeks ago I drink a bottle of dayquel during the day and a bottle of nightquil at night for 2 days 2 nights,ate all fruit lot of oranges n knocked it out of me

sean

I seen a bunch of steel valve kits on ebay for 125 to 150$

masterlink

good content. keep it going. Throw a set of rings on that bad boy also. look at those ridges on the valve edge.

howd the cams look?? gonna du a cam chain 2?? prolly cheap money. OEM prolly <$40

markyrocks

Trust me I'm kicking myself BC I should just be throwing new piston an rings an new Cam chain in it as well but I'm so pressed for time an money ATM. I have a trip planned March 2-3 and I need to have this thing running in top shape.

Dropped head at shop this morn. Hope they can do it today or I have to wait till Monday.

sean

When you go to steel valves you have to put heavier springs???? correct????

markyrocks

Steel valves are stock in this quad so don't need springs unless there out of spec. As far as a bike that come stock with titanium valves... I have no clue. If it required by the OEM to have titanium valves you may not be able to find steel valves for it. Even if you can It would be a downgrade (I think?) But you may not want to BC I'm sure the engineers who designed the bike had good reason to make it that way. Could be something most wouldn't think of like the head made of an odd metal mixture and when certain metals stay in contact they corrode each other. Or I could just be talking out my ass.

masterlink

lol

markyrocks

Well for anyone planning on doin a valve job yourself I recommend you make the following tool and use a big c clamp to compress the spring during reinstallation. (Make sure u put piece of cardboard between clamp and the head)

And a pic of the valves reinstalled

markyrocks

I know my tool ain't pretty but it works. Made it in like 5 min with a deep socket and a grinder.

masterlink

I have a Tusk Valve tool $35

markyrocks

Well I may have to buy that next time around. It was just the video I watched the Guy got the keepers back in with just a pair of needle nose pliers ...... apparently it takes a special touch to do it BC I tried several times that way with no luck. The first time doing something new is always a pita.

masterlink

I watched that vid also. Guys gut skillz.

if u du a fair amount of ur own work its worth the $$.

I've made a chit load of tools in the past, but slowly just buy the right 1 sooner or later. Especially now that companies like Motion Pro and Tusk r making them quite cheap. U can even find a dec buy at Harbour freight now and again.

sean

you should buy the proper tools, probably on ebay cheap did you get a cycmer manual

sean

I'm paying close attention to this thread,im going to be doing this soon

markyrocks

Its too late now Sean the deed is done. Like I said before highly doubtful u will need to do this. I have a manual that I downloaded onto my phone. I wouldn't do this type if stuff without one. As far as the tool goes I've made custom tools before no biggie. I'm just in a time an money crunch ATM.

markyrocks

Ill post this for Sean

NZrider

Sean if you need to do this anytime in the next 2 years then you're doing something very wrong to your bike or you do ALOT of hours. your 450 wont need new valves till at least 100 hours

masterlink

everytime I watch that video, i think there is hope 4 the children of future.

markyrocks

Why is that?

sean

I watched it marky,thanks

sean

Nz Ryder I dont dog her,but when on tight trails I do have to ride clutch and rev her up some other then that,I probably put 10 hours a weekend on it sometimes a little more.I want to learn to do all the work myself, I enjoy working on my bike but I get nervous on things I never done before, I change transmission oil,motor oil,oil filter,air filter after every ride faithfully no matter what,if I ride for 4 hours I change it,and I flush it everytime.my bike is what I enjoy that's why I want to take care of it. yesterday the back wheel and all the plastic was off, I bought some Pro Circuit axle blocks for better markings,there a bit longer n thicker I like them..my girl came out to the garage n was pissed she was wondering why a new bike is all ripped apart.still hearing about that but she dont know when I do put new valves in it im going to make some upgrades while im in there,and im going with stainless

markyrocks

Sean, as far as upgrades goes while doin a valve job you'd be able to (besides the valves) get some aftermarket cams and better Cam chain, head gasket spacer for higher compression, better springs. You could even go crazy an get the head ported an use over sized valves. But you do all that your prolly gona need a power commander, full race exhaust. The next step after that is prolly big bore kit, bigger injectors, ignition module..... you'd have a rocket.

As a side note I put quad back together and it started up so I must of done something right

sean

This will be later on down the road when I have to do a topend ill bore it, I forgot about injectors,, I don't even know if they sell aftermarket body throttles ill check,I have been looking at some pipes but I just put 1000 dollers in the bike so ill wait work has been real slow hoping picks up by spring, I got the rear brakes working thanks marky

masterlink

u put a G in2 wat?

masterlink

Marky cuz most kidz I kno could'nt find the needle nose in the drawer let alone use them to manipulate valve keepers.

sean

I put a stack in my bike,i told you I ordered, a bunch of pro circuit parts, aluminum throttle tube, axle blocks, engine plug with dipstick, rear brake clevis, brake hose clamp, foot pegs,net for gas tank,skid plate, exhaust gard, Plastics ,decals, I got 200 in just oils n filters probably closer to 1500 still not done need y hose ,service manual,tools,x ring chain, Pro Circuit water pump, frame guards, im completely redesigning the bike

sean

masterlink I knew you was gonna say that

sean

as soon as you said there's hope for the future

sean

I wasn't planning to but that's the way the directions is going

sean

some of you all are not into all this and think its a waist,but that's how I like it,older dudes like to leave it how it comes,

sean

Im going to budds creak in the spring to race her ,ill do some upgrades internally when I have to open it up

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